JW elder: "Where did you get that video, Isambard? Have you been visiting apostate sites? How do you even know that video is legitimate? We get our direction from Jehovah's Organization - not from apostate sites or lawyers. What Bible based direction has the Faithful and Discreet Slave given pertaining to the treatment of disfellowshipped ones? Why would you choose to ignore their direction in favor of what is said on a video of questionable origin and legitimacy? Isambard, you need to readjust your thinking. Right now you're treading on dangerous ground."
Island Man
JoinedPosts by Island Man
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23
If we just suddenly start talking to DFed people again and use the Canada court video as our argument, what would happen?
by Isambard Crater inthe jw lawyer clearly stated that disfellowshipping only applies to spiritual association, but everyday family contact is ok..
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Jesus and Satan’s Hilly hike
by EverApostate ini got an inspiration to create this topic as a subset of another topic.
satan in heaven.. as per the bible,the devil took jesus to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor.
below is a reference from another critic.
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Island Man
The Earth is supported against the gravity of the Sun, and not falling into it,
Forgive my pedantry, but actually, the Earth is falling toward the sun. It wouldn't be orbiting the Sun if it wasn't. Orbit is achieved when the speed of horizontal movement parallel to the surface of the star or planet you're orbiting is such that the rate at which you're falling toward the planet or star equals the rate at which the surface of the planet of star is curving down away from you.
Centrifugal force does not apply to orbiting because the orbiting body isn't fixed to the object it's orbiting. If you speed up the forward speed of the earth it will just orbit further away from the sun or leave orbit altogether.
And the Bible's statement that the Earth is hanging on nothing is totally wrong because the Earth isn't hanging at all. The earth is hurtling through space in a corkscrew motion. It is orbiting around the sun and the sun in turn is orbiting the galaxy in a plane that is perpendicular to the earth's plane of orbit around the sun. When you combine the two motions the earth is making a corkscrew path through space.
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not a new topic - really a pet peave
by Moster inmakes me crazy:.
there: go over there!.
their: they own it; belonging to etc.. for the love of pete - use them correctly!.
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Island Man
'phoned in over the years to point out it "should have been called Pedant's Corner "
Actually is should be Pedants' Corner (apostrophe after the s)
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Biblical incidents that bothered me.
by EverApostate ini wanted to discuss the (supposed) biblical events that disturbed me a lot when i was a jw.
these incidents were just read and discussed in the kingdom hall as if these are normal and justified, which clearly weren't.
perhaps this led to my awakening.
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Island Man
Others that bothered me:
The armies that were incinerated by fire when they came to Elijah pleading with him to come with them to meet with the king.
The many bystanders that were struck dead because they happened to see the ark of the covenant on its return journey while they were celebrating its return from the enemy.
The prophet who was deceived into eating and drinking and was killed by a lion for doing so.
God allowing the Israelites to attack Ai and suffer loss of life before telling them that he was not backing them because someone (Achan) stole.
What a heartless god! No wonder the pharisees were the way they were. They learned their heartless legalism from the OT. Reasonable, Jesus-like characters who bended the rules for the sake of compassion and reasonableness were killed without mercy in the OT.
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Hoping I can stay
by allyson ini started studying with witnesses about 21 months ago.
started going to meetings in march 2017, went to the memorial and attended my first convention.
i love it.
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Island Man
They can't stop you attending by meetings as infinitum as a non baptised person.
Actually, they can. They can tell her that her implied invitation has been revoked and future visits to the kingdom hall will be treated as trespassing.
They typically do this when apostates come around and start asking difficult questions or start sharing TTATT.
Given JWs' strong bigotry against gays and transsexuals it's not too much of a stretch to think that they might do this to her if they sense she's intent on remaining a trans woman and is of the adamant view that Jehovah accepts her as such. They might consider her presence at the kingdom hall, dressed as a woman, as "upsetting to others" and a "spiritual danger" to the congregation. I think there's at least a 50% chance of this happening.
Keep this in mind: the very act of a biological man dressing as a woman is deemed by them as a serious sin worthy of disfellowshipping. So every time Allyson comes to the meetings dressed as a woman, the JWs - from their perspective - are witnessing a serious, gross sin taking place in their kingdom hall right before their eyes! From a strictly pseudo-logical, scriptural perspective it is comparable to a person coming to the meeting and publicly committing fornication at the kingdom hall in the presence of everyone.
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Can you be disfellowshiped for reading other religious materials?
by paradisebeauty ini am having a conversation with a jw and they say you can not be disfellowshiped for this.
is this true?
i thought you can be disfellowshiped for this.
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Island Man
It is very strongly frowned upon. You would not be regarded as being exemplary. You will definitely be counseled for it. Your response to the counsel could determine whether or not a judicial committee needs to be formed to explore the charge of apostasy or interfaith. In and of itself it's probably not enough to get your DF'd, but your attitude toward it - if you agree with what the other religion is teaching and/or if you're sharing those ideas with others - can get you disfellowshipped.
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In theory, can one be disfellowshipped for attempted suicide?
by Saename inso i was recently reading the reasons for disfellowshipping as listed in shepherd the flock of god.
the handbook is available online here: https://thetruthofjehowaswittness.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/jehovas-vitner.pdf.. on page 59, point #4, it lists attempted suicide as a reason for disfellowshipping.
has it ever been removed?
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Island Man
If one can be DF'd for attempted suicide then doesn't that give suicidal JWs added motivation to ensure that their plot to take their own life, succeeds?
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matured mentally
by Akid48 ini dont know if any one else is feeling this but after waking up i feel like i matured mentally etc.. im only 13 maybe its just me but i wanted to know if any had this feeling just a quick post..
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Island Man
I notice that I've become a lot more accepting and a lot less critical of non-JWs.
JW culture creates and foster prejudice against non-JWs by labelling them all as 'worldy' and 'bad association'. JWs tend to always be looking for bad traits in non-JWs so they can look down on them and pridefully reflect on how fortunate they [the JW] are to be part of Jehovah's clean organization.
Also, since learning TTATT I came to appreciate that many of the bad traits I once saw in non-JWs were not really bad at all, but were just petty judgments based on self-righteous, pharisaic interpretations of scripture. Celebrating Christmas, birthdays, mother's day, etc, aren't really bad things. People don't partake in these observances with any pagan motives in their heart. The JWs' condemnation of these things are based purely on stigma. JWs worship a god of stigma.
One of the things that struck me about the JW reasoning on observing holidays with pagan roots is this:
JWs will say that a person who observes these holidays is guilty of worshiping false gods even though they observe them with innocent, non-pagan motives. So it's that easy to worship a false god! You can worship a false god by accident without even intending to! But then they turn around and do the opposite for all the earnest church-goers of Christendom who are actively and deliberately directing worship to the god of the Bible - surely their deliberate effort must mean that they're worshiping the god of the Bible, right? According to the JWs, no. They're worshipping Satan! See the hypocrisy?
They lower the threshold for what qualifies as worship so they can accuse holiday celebrants of worshiping false gods, even though they're not intending to. But they raise the bar high to disqualify the willful, intentional worship directed to the god of the Bible just so they can say persons in Christendom are not worshiping the god of the Bible. There's is something very wrong and hypocritical about this.
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Is There Any Thing That Would Make A JW SERIOUSLY Question Their Religion?
by minimus ini realize that jehovah’s witnesses have been dumbed down for long time now.
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still, i think there must be something that would make them really question their beliefs, even their life.. i think that if witnesses were told they could take blood or that disfellowshipping was unloving, they might stop and take a hard look at everything they have sacrificed their lives for.. i know the organization has muddled these subjects before but the i think even die hard witnesses might start to second guess the governing body..
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Island Man
I will say that for the overwhelming majority of JWs, only a very negative, disillusioning personal experience in the religion, will get them to seriously question their religion.
Very few will seriously question after hearing TTATT. Most dismiss TTATT as being nothing but "apostate driven" lies.
JWs have been carefully trained to dull their own rational, logical and critical thinking skills in favor of gullible emotional thinking that blindly and naively laps up rose-colored, self-serving, emotive Watchtower propaganda and super cynically and prejudicially dismisses all negative information just because it is negative, without any regard whatsoever as to testing out its truthfulness. In fact, many JWs will outright tell you they do not want to hear it, if they know you're about to share negative information with them. Classic burying the head in the sand!
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Faced with the reality of mortality
by stuckinarut2 inhow have you all coped with facing the reality of our mortality?.
most of us were raised to firmly believe we would never get old or die... so here we are now having to face the reality that are getting older... we are going to die.. sometimes it really pisses me off that we were never helped to comprehend this most basic of facts.
we were given a utopian dream as a "fact", and hence never taught how to face our inevitable futures.... thoughts?.
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Island Man
How have you all coped with facing the reality of our mortality?
I remind myself that I was dead once before - before I was conceived. I think of my future demise as simply a return to my non-existent state before conception. I do not grieve the time I did not exist before conception, so why should I be grieved about the time I will not exist when I die?
I will not miss out on anything when I die because I will be unconscious. To miss out on something you have to be conscious of the fact that that thing exists and you're not experiencing it. So I know I will not be missing out on anything when I die because I will not have the consciousness required to experience loss and missing out. We only think we'll be missing out because we look at our death through the eyes of the living. You have to resist that temptation and look at your death through the eyes of the dead.
The worst part about dying could be that it happens painfully. But don't we experience pain when we get sick but do not die? Haven't you been sick before, in pain? So why should the pain of dying be dreaded any more than the pain we have already experienced without dying?
Death does no harm to the dead. Death only grieves the living. Don't grieve over your own death. Grieve over the death of a loved one.
If there is any religion I will get behind, it's a rational, non-theistic religion that focuses on this subject of coping with our own mortality, overcoming the irrational fear of death. I believe that once we sit down and meditate carefully on what our death actually entails and how it actually will not affect us in any way, much of the irrational fear and anxiety surrounding our mortality disappears.